An interview with Free Minds member Charles, by Kelli, co-founder and Book Club Manager. This interview was originally published in Volume 12, Issue 5 of the Free Minds Connect.
To be resilient is to be able to withstand or recover from very difficult conditions. I can’t think of
conditions any more difficult than those experienced by FM member, Charles. At the age of 20, Charles
and several other young men were charged and convicted of the brutal attack and murder of a
49-year-old woman in Northeast DC. Charles served 36 and a half years for a crime that he did not do.
Despite his innocence, Charles was sentenced to 35 years to life. Throughout his sentence, he refused to
take the option of parole because he knew he would never be willing to admit to a crime he did not commit. He and his co-defendants (also Free Minds members) are models of resilience. The story of their
case, which was taken all the way to the Supreme Court, has been featured in the Netflix series The
Confession Tapes: 8th and H, a New America podcast called “The Alley: DC’s 8th and H Street Case,” a Washington Post story from reporter Joe Heim (“They served decades in prison for a crime they say they didn’t commit”), and Thomas Dybdahl‘s recently published book, When Innocence Is Not Enough.
Charles is a leader in our reentry community, who helps to co-facilitate our weekly “Build
Up” book club sessions when he’s not working. I recently met up with Charles in a quiet basement lobby of the Martin Luther King DC Public Library, where he has now worked for two years.
First, can you tell me what job you thought about or dreamed about when you were locked up? What was your dream job?
To tell you the truth, during those years, I didn’t even think about getting out with the amount of time I’d
been given. Who thinks about getting out? Even at that young age, I never thought I would get out. So, I never dreamed of a particular job. Instead, I just focused on the jobs I got in prison.
At one prison, I took a business class and became computer literate. One day, I went into the business
office in UNICOR and told the supervisor there that I wanted to work with him as a procurement officer. That’s the person who does all of the ordering of supplies. I told him why I thought I could do the job. I guess he liked what I said because he hired me. I dealt with hundreds of government contracts. We had a team of two people, but when the other guy left, they didn’t need to hire anyone, because I was the one who knew how to do it. I’m kind of proud of that.
I went to another prison and became an upholsterer. I became very good at upholstering. I ended up
becoming the right-hand man to the plant manager. Even the CO’s that worked there had to listen to what I said, because I was the one who knew what I was talking about! They respected what I knew.
At the next place they transferred me, I started out in the kitchen and wound up working in the officers dining room, cooking for the officers, the executive staff and for the warden. I even cooked a meal for the Director of the Federal Bureau of Prisons when he visited. He liked my meal. I was the highest paid person in the kitchen. I think I was pretty good.
Why do you think you were so successful in those jobs?
Well, I think it’s the way I go about doing the jobs I do. I always looked at it as mastering skills. If I’m going to do something, I want to be the best at it. That’s what I hang my hat on. If I get a job, I’m going to learn it and I’m going to master it. I’m going to move my way up!
Can you tell me about how you got your current job?
As soon as I got home, I went to this program that taught us how to write our resumes and market ourselves to employers. They connected us to employers that were willing to give a second chance to someone with a criminal record. I got a job with a company called Community Bridge. At first, I got placed cleaning hotels during the pandemic. Some months later, my boss said he needed somebody to go to their biggest client, which was the DC Public Library, and he chose me. I was so happy because it is a full-time job with full benefits! I took that position and am a contract worker on the library’s facilities management team.
What exactly do you do?
We do everything. We move furniture, clean up messes, and prepare and set up for all the events at the library. We do everything to maintain the look and function of the facility both inside and outside for the public to use and enjoy. And like I said, I like to master everything that I do. So, I really see myself here as a problem solver. Solving problems is easy for me, but you’d be surprised how many people out here don’t have that skill. I had to program the walkie talkies for everyone that works in maintenance because the supervisors—people that have been here for years—didn’t know how to do it. I’m the guy everyone goes to when they have a problem or need something fixed. They all just say, “Ask Charles, he’ll be able to
fix it” (laughs).
It seems like there is so much going on here. Is it a good place to work?
It’s a great place to work. Everybody that comes out of prison in DC should come to the MLK Library because everything they need is here. You can come here and take a computer literacy course. They’ll teach you how to send and receive emails, teach you about all basic computer skills that we lack when we get home. Even though there are computers in prison now, they’re so limited as to what you can do. They’ll teach you Microsoft Word, Excel, every basic program. And guess what? It’s all free! Get your Social Security card, your ID. They’ll give you referrals for other resources and services. They even have culinary training in the café. And they send those people off to good jobs.
Can you tell me what’s going on down on this floor? What are all of these different glassed-in rooms?
(Points to across the lobby) That’s a sound studio right there. You can learn audio tech and they’ve got a music studio. You can learn how to do a podcast and then use the studio here for free to record and broadcast it. There’s a room over there where you can research your ancestors. They got professional genealogy staff. Anyone can go in; give them a few names and they’ll research your ancestry! In this room you can learn pottery in a studio with a kiln. Over here, you can learn to sew. They’ve got sewing machines you can use for free. I mean it’s just so much you can come in here and learn. Anything you want! This is a very good place to work. You meet interesting people from all over the world.
They are always having authors come to talk about their books. I’ll set up for them and a lot of times, if I can, I’ll stay and listen. I just went to one. The writer’s parents were victims of the Holocaust during
World War II. It was powerful!
This is a free space where everyone is represented. We don’t turn away people who have nowhere else to go. Mayor Muriel Bowser has directed us to allow everyone to be here as long as they’re being respectful. So much happens here. You know that yourself, because I saw you back in May here for the Leonardo DaVinci exhibit.
That was awesome! They had a display of 12 drawings — the actual drawings, notes and diagrams of ideas and inventions by Leonardo DaVinci from 1478 to 1519. We got to see his drawings that were more than 500 years old! Did you know DaVinci was lefthanded and wrote backwards? Isn’t that crazy?
Yes, I loved that exhibit! It’s all your culture in one building.
Right over there? That’s a ballet center. People come in and dance, do yoga. They have story time for all different ages, so if you’re a parent, you can always find activities for your children here. It’s a hub of activity and there is something for everyone. I always thought Martin Luther King was just for Blacks, but he’s not. He represented everybody. We kinda get it twisted, but he was for everybody! And this space is named for him. That’s what this library is.
You said you never dreamed of a job because you didn’t think you’d be free. But now you are free. Do you have a dream job now?
I do. I’d like to be a procurement manager. I want to use those skills I built and developed with UNICOR at an even higher level in a job where I can have total financial security. To be honest, I think fear is holding me back just a little bit at this point. Sometimes I worry my skills won’t be good enough and I have a fear of failing. But I know myself. If you put me in a job and give me half a chance, I’m gonna excel. I always want to be on top. I want to be the one running things. I’m the one who is going to learn everything there is to know. I will get there!
As you know, this issue of the Connect is on the theme of resilience. With that in mind, what advice do you have for Free Minds members preparing to enter or reenter the world of work?
I would tell people coming home they need to develop a tough skin. They can’t get discouraged when they get turned down. We just had a job fair here. But some companies don’t hire people with a record. They’ll say they do, but there’s a lot of men and women that get discouraged. People need to know how to present themselves. A lot of guys get upset and angry. Because a lot of them had jobs inside, but it’s different. The people that want to change and reinvent themselves are going to have better luck. Just know you might be treated in a way you don’t feel like you should be treated. You have to just let that roll off. That’s being resilient. A lot of times, they’re testing you. And if you get an attitude, you’re not
going to get the job or you’re not going to keep the job.
Sometimes you got to start with a job that isn’t really your dream job. The ugly jobs. Work your way up. You can’t think you’re going to come out here and make $70,000 a year right off the bat. You gotta start somewhere and stay with it and be serious about reinventing yourself. Learn to deal with people being over you, having authority. It’s difficult and that’s understandable. We’re used to the way CO’s and police have been talking to us. But don’t always think everything is personal. Be patient with people. Getting angry doesn’t help you. Employers will reward you when they see how you carry yourself. Someone might say their way is right, but you know you are right. You got to suck it up because you need that job. That’s being resilient. Change is hard and it’s incremental, one step at a time.
Have a plan. List the things you want to do, starting with small goals. Meet those goals and then make bigger goals and keep going. You just have to be patient. People out here can’t even wait at a traffic light! I will sit there and people will go around me looking at me all crazy. But I’m gonna be patient. I’m not going to get a ticket and go to jail again! I’ll sit at that light (laughs).
Resilience. Everybody doesn’t have it. Too many people still have a foot back in the streets even when they come home. You gotta be strong and not bend. You gotta walk right. Be trustworthy. And sometimes you gotta start from the ground up. Get all that old stuff out of you. Wash it off! Change everything, your whole way of thinking. When you change your perception, that change will change you.
Thank you, Charles, for sharing your experience and wisdom with the Free Minds Family. We look forward to watching you continue your ascent, setting and achieving goals one by one, all the way up to securing that dream job as a procurement officer!